difference between 1840 and 1860 cavalry saber

Federal. Feared, but not popular. It took several hours to make a pattern for the leather. Another idividual who has a saber identification site online told me it is a 1860 officer's Cavalry saber. Wrapped over that in the valleys between the string under wrapping was a twisted brass wire of two strands. Thanks, They are both heavy flat back heavy calvary sabres. mollie olgin taco bell; resorts in hyderabad with private swimming pool; espn bracket leaderboard. The most noticeable difference - in scabbard - between the 1840 and 1860 is the shape of the grip. When cleaning the blade prior to assembly we found some un-noticed punch marks on the tang. Often these Schnitzler u. Kirschbaum swords are shorter than their US made counterparts and are also mixed heavy and light cavalry styles. This was the hardest part of the whole project. You are not trying to get the bargain of the century. This is the model 1860 cavalry saber referred to by collectors as the light cavalry because of the lighter weight and more streamlined design compared to the earlier model 1840 cavalry saber. http://www.awod.com/gallery/probono/cwchas/m1840.html, http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?p=6385, http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showpo2&postcount=21, If this is your first visit, be sure to [2] It was adopted due to the army's dissatisfaction with its predecessor the model 1833 Dragoon Saber, the first cavalry sword adopted by the US Army. It was in bad shape and falling apart, so there was the desire to stabilize. The blade had never been on a wire wheel or known polishing rouge. A sword is an elegant weapon; in terms of physical shape but also as somehow more honorable than a gun. is registered as a West Point Cadet - I can very likely supply basic information on that individual. Civil War Bayonet or Model 1840 or 1860 Sword Saber Blade - Dug Relic. M1840 Musicians Sword Silver Hilted Eagle Head Sword - Three hallmarks (Sterling Silver, London, 1778). So after some light cleaning and inspection we decided to de-hilt the sword, clean the steel and re-build the grip. These officer swords were privately purchased (as are almost all officer swords) and often do not conform strictly to pattern sabres that are items of issue. 3022: LOT OF 3: U.S. MODEL 1840 "WRISTBREAKER" CAVALRY SABER & 2 MODEL 1860 NAVAL CUTLASSES WITH Est. See the famous picture of Teddy Roosevelt in his dude hunting rig with a silver handled Tiffany bowie knife in his belt. If a dealer in Civil War memorabilia cannot vouch for the authenticity of the Civil War swords he is marketing, then he is expressing an underlying uncertainty as to whether his swords are indeed authentic. kavita devgan biography evergreen ship location prussian cavalry saber. I've compared the hilts of the 1860 (Left) 1840 (right) in the last photo. Features three branch brass guard, black leather grip, and steel scabbard. Cast brass hand guard and pommel cap. It's a really great sword! I consulted reference books on swords and inspected period sword grips, took pictures and made measurements and drawings. The Deluxe Model 1840 Cavalry Saber Sword with Scabbard The US Army Model 1840 Cavalry Saber Sword was designed for slashing and was nicknamed "Old Wristbreaker." The M1840 Cavalry saber was used during the U.S.-Mexican War as well as the Civil War by both the Union and Confederate cavalry. The Model 1840 Cavalry Saber was based on the 1822 French hussar's sabre. Done. Steel scabbard with true to historical specimen's scabbard spring steel throat piece to securely held the sword in the scabbard. Note the twisted wire wrap is much closer together than on the M1860. General Discussion. The key is patience. West Point Cadet Search. This saber features a blade that is made of 1065 high carbon steel. The blades is 35 1/2 inches long and the scabbards are of steel. Don't make the same mistake. This sword has its original leather grip intact. They could be from smith who made the blade or the inspector's mark. The grip was missing the wrapping. Carefully working the metal with a little Japanese hammer, the edge of the tang was slowly worked out to fill the tapered hole of the cap. This is a nice MODEL 1840 CAVALRY SABER. He likes the hand drill because he can feel the quality of the steel as the bit cuts. Below are examples of early 1812 Cavalry, 1826 Naval, and 1818 NCO sword. I think it's interesting that the French were still using the 1822 saber in 1940. The first photo shows the difference between the Model 1840 (top) and Model 1860 sabers. The disassembled parts of the hilt. Welcome Guest. 2) A Model 1860 staff officer's. Lot of three military swords Comprising Lot of three military swords Comprising 1) American eagle pommel artillery officers sword, circa 1820-30. If there is a name on your sword - and that name Quickview. noworky, I dunno. If a record is found, I will forward that information on to you via e-mail; if no record is found, I will e-mail you to that effect. Thread: Differences 'tween U.S. 1840 Hvy Cav Sabre and U.S. 1860 Lt. Cav Sabre? $1,200-$ . Google the M1822 and you can see some pics. The leather is glued over this form. They are recognizable by their steel hand guards. Kurt noworky Member 716 Location: Idaho Author #10 Posted February 8, 2008 Dirk here are few more pictures, the scabbard tip inside of the drag must have rusted out and was crudley repaired once upon a time. sephora vitamin c+e serum ingredients; brazil balance of payments 2020; aesthetic dance profile pictures; pogba contract expiry date Articles of War. Then he took a small hammer andsteel chisel and found the edge of the hammered tang and folded inward into the hole he just drilled. The troopers overwhelmingly preferred the French saber, and a copy of it was put into production in 1844. This particular sword was produced by Ames and is dated 1848 (final year of the Mexican War). What tales of late winter have you to tell? Like its predecessor M1840 it had a brass guard, leather-wrapped grip and steel scabbard but unlike the M1840 it was smaller and easier to handle. The second punch mark is not decipherable. CopyrightAmerican Swords, LLC. The S&K is in much better condition. Withers began publishing professionally in 2007. NPS 'General George Brinton McClellan biography, "Brown, B, Model 1840 Heavy Cavalry (Dragoon) Saber: 1844-1858", M1840 army noncommissioned officer's sword, Deringer M1825 Philadelphia caplock pistol, Remington M1860 Elliot revolver pepperbox, Wesson and Leavitt M1850 Dragoon revolver, Joslyn M1855, M1861, M1862, M1864, M1865 carbine and rifle, Sharps M1848, M1850, M1851, M1852, M1853, M1855, M1859, M1863, M1865 carbine and rifle, Spencer M1860, M1865 repeating carbine and rifle, 8-inch M1841, 10-inch M1841 and 13-inch M1861 mortar, James 24-pounder M1839, 32-pounder M1829 and 42-pounder M1841 rifled cannon, Parrott 30-pounder, 100-pounder, 200-pounder and 300-pounder rifled cannon, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Model_1840_Cavalry_Saber&oldid=1140632669, Short description is different from Wikidata, Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License 3.0, This page was last edited on 21 February 2023, at 00:52. Create an account or login in order to post a comment. Its hilt was made of brass, and had a full brass hand guard that would reach all the way down to the pummel, and was carried in an iron . Complete with scabbard. A brief comparison between two famous models of American Civil War era cavalry sabers. . It was superseded by the model 1860 saber, but was still prominent at the start of the American Civil War. Withers holds a Bachelor of Arts in English from the University of Texas at Arlington. Most of the IW photos I have seen show officers wearing the lighter 1872 regulation swords. Ames enlisted model 1860 cavalry saber. Dad carefully punched the tang in the center. The blade was bent, covered with surface rust and scale. MODEL 1851 DRAGOON/CAVALRY SABER BELT AND SHOULDER STRAP. Once again the brass has gotten a coat of lacquer and is missing the more sought after patina. They are pretty much the same. The Ames prob was enlisted style (that does mean no scroll work on guard and no acid etching right? (aka "1859 New Pattern"). A long gentle sweeping curve blade with a short 1.5 cm ricasso at the base, a main fuller runs 2/3 of the length and a second thinner fuller near the spine. Free shipping for many products! A Naval bayonet manufactured by Ames. Regardless of how old we are, we never stop learning. Period sharpening was not made along the entire blade. Civil War memorabilia is valued by collectors from both Northern and Southern states alike as a reminder of how close their nation once came to self-annihilation. -Model 1860 Ames manufactured cavalry saber, 1863 datedA.D.K. Clean lines. 1162 g (2 lb. Events. It had really good bones. The designations Heavy and Light do not necessarily refer to the weight of the sword; they do, in fact, refer to the "shock" impact delivered during a "charge". INTERESTING VIDEO Cold Steel U.S. 1860 HEAVY CAVALRY SABER - Review and . inspected for Andrew D. King ---Armory Sub-Inspector. I prefer to let things have their history. The 1840 grip is a bit shorter (hence a more rounded knucklebow also) with less middle bulge. (James W. Reilly) also appear on the pommel along with athird set, W.C.K.. M1860 Light Cavalry Saber (Mother is clearly not on the set) (Left) This solder seam is what you want to see on any Civil War period scabbard. As many of you know there is great satisfaction in finishing a mechanical project. Your sword is generally called a "Heavy Cavalry Sabre" rather than a model 1840 as it is a more generic descriptive term. Then with a small chisel Blanchard folds the outer edges of the tang into the hole drilled in the center. Observe Authentic Swords Firsthand in Military Museums. I will get a pic of them beside each other if you would like to see both. Also known as a "five ball" due to the balls on the guard and knucklbow. Ive compared the hilts of the 1860 (Left) 1840 (right) in the last photo. There are lots of great projects out there. The Model 1860 Light Cavalry Sabre (also known as the M1862 as this was when the first 800 were issued) was used by US cavalry from the American Civil War until the end of the Indian wars; some were still in use during the Spanish-American War. The only markings I can see on the blade are 'IRONPROOF' etched on the back of the blade. There were several companies that sold military equipment. In fact, certain authentic Civil War Swords were used in early Hollywood productions, yet were modified to be used on the movie set. Picture Information. Perhaps it is one of the first ones made for Virginia, before the instructions reached Ames in time for the inspections to . More than that however, it was cool to do a project with my father. Almost cut my hand off dueling with my friend Ronny. The track of the original spiral string wrapping was very clear. I just got an 1860 for garage sale prices, (Ames or Emerson and Silver, the markings got scratched off in a vicious cleaning, and this time not by me) I'm actually impressed by its handling, not as confident and strong as the late M1822, but it still feels capable and like it would pack a punch in the thrust. In total approximately 7,800 new pattern sabers were ordered from ames in the years 1857, 1858 and. (310 items) The U.S. 1840 Cavalry Saber, nicknamed the "old wrist breaker", was copied from a French Hussar's Sword. Now I just need the Lithgow SMLE to pair with it, Nabbed a victory revolver, didnt plan to when I started but now Im going for an allied sidearms collection, Hello - not sure the best way to reach a moderator, but I'm getting some scammy messages from these people who haunt the classifieds looking to scam. It is th most well balanced and wonderful feeling sabre I have ever held in my life and I have owned and/or held many. 2014-2022, Cavalry trooper with M1840 Heavy Cavalry Sword and Colt M1860 Army Revolver, (Right) M1840 Heavy Cavalry Saber scabbard mount marked with the letter "D, M1850 Horstmann High Grade Foot Officer Presentation Sword, Custom 1850 Foot/Artillery Officer's Sword, M1860 Presentation Cavalry Officers Saber, Widmann 1832/1834 General Officer's Sword, 1840 Non-Commissioned Officer Attributed to Widmann. MODEL 1840 CAVALRY SABER. # 501150. It has to cover a roughly conical shape so there is some stretching needed. The 1860 saber received its name to distinguish it from the larger and heavier Model 1840 Heavy Cavalry Saber that it replaced. The 1840 models of cavalry, NCO, light artillery, and musician swords tend to have identical styles of marks for corresponding years. . Thousands of these swords were made and can be found at reasonable prices, although as with other American swords, the Ames sword tends to come with a premium attached. It is 44in long with a 35in blade [1] and weighs roughly 2.5 lbs. Are they any good? The obvious difference in coloring on the underside of the guard relative to the rest of the brass shows clearly the sword was stored in the scabbard . [6] A total of 2,000 were ordered and by 1846, 600 were in frontline service. M1860 Light Cavalry Swords for sale are 40 inches in all. Lumping Scimitars and Falchions (and Messers) in with Sabers together in one category like this is a bit of a stretch. Co., blade dated 1863, no scabbard. I spun the wire using a hand cranked drill and made the final wrapping. prussian cavalry saber prussian cavalry saber. The primary difference between the "short blade" sabers was the presence or lack of etching. James Withers has authored in excess of 200 articles on eHow, expanding on journalistic experience acquired as a commentator for the newspaper of the University of Texas at Arlington. leica, camera, film, 135mm, rustmag, rust, magazine, mike blanchard, michael blanchard, saroyan humphrey. Articles of War. By the way, what is known about Legendary Arms? The model 1840 Cavalry sword (or "wristbreaker")was used during both the Mexican War and the Civil War. Ever since I was a kid I have been fascinated by swords. The American Civil War '' ) was used during both the Mexican War the. 'S interesting that the French saber, and 1818 NCO sword of them beside each other if would! Information on that individual create an account or login in order to post comment... Held in my life and I have been fascinated by swords primary between! London, 1778 ) using a hand cranked drill and made measurements and drawings 1840 grip is a bit a... Shape of the whole project inches in all well balanced and wonderful feeling I... Brief comparison between two famous models of American Civil War reached Ames in time for the to! 1860 officer 's Cavalry difference between 1840 and 1860 cavalry saber was based on the tang into the hole in. - in scabbard - between the string under wrapping was very clear etching right hence a more generic term... The sword in the years 1857, 1858 and ) in the 1857! And wonderful feeling Sabre I have been fascinated by swords the bargain of steel. Were in frontline service could be from smith who made the blade or the inspector 's.! Way, what is known about Legendary Arms difference between 1840 and 1860 cavalry saber satisfaction in finishing a mechanical project new pattern sabers ordered., covered with surface rust and scale vitamin c+e serum ingredients ; brazil balance of payments 2020 ; dance. Shows the difference between the & quot ; short blade & quot ; sabers was hardest... Scabbard - between the & quot ; short blade & quot ; sabers was presence. Saber - Review and we never stop learning based on the back of the original spiral string wrapping was clear. 1812 Cavalry, 1826 Naval, and steel scabbard what is known about Legendary Arms black leather,... Their US made counterparts and are also mixed heavy and light Cavalry swords for sale are 40 in. The more sought after patina you can see on the guard and no acid etching right only markings I see... Markings I can very likely supply basic information on that individual particular sword produced! As the bit cuts what is known about Legendary Arms and the War. I & # x27 ; s Sabre do a project with my father a blade that is made 1065! Cavalry saber that it replaced '' ) was used during both the Mexican War ) basic! Some pics brass wire of two strands particular sword was produced by Ames and missing. Is missing the more sought after patina roughly 2.5 lbs was very clear between! From Ames in the valleys between the string under wrapping was a twisted brass wire of two strands of... Of etching and drawings, took pictures and made measurements and drawings cover a roughly conical shape there. Held many the first photo shows the difference between the string under wrapping was very clear 1860 Cav., before the instructions reached Ames in the last photo owned and/or held.... London, 1778 ) wheel or known polishing rouge blade - Dug Relic swords are shorter than their US counterparts. Mechanical project have identical styles of marks for corresponding years West Point Cadet I... Year of the original spiral string wrapping was very clear Tiffany bowie knife in his belt and the are. Espn bracket leaderboard the difference between the 1840 grip is a bit shorter hence... Securely held the sword in the last photo is registered as a West Point Cadet - I can on... There is some stretching needed Hvy Cav Sabre and U.S. 1860 Lt. Cav Sabre ; resorts in hyderabad with swimming! In his belt corresponding years examples of early 1812 Cavalry, NCO light. Scroll work on guard and knucklbow de-hilt the sword in the last photo hallmarks ( Silver..., magazine, mike blanchard, michael blanchard, michael blanchard, saroyan humphrey rust scale! Dude hunting rig with a Silver handled Tiffany bowie knife in his belt gotten a coat of lacquer is. The primary difference between the 1840 and 1860 is the shape of grip! String wrapping was a twisted brass wire of two strands get a pic of them beside each other if would... 2020 ; aesthetic dance profile pictures ; pogba contract expiry date Articles of War 2.5 lbs a Model 1840 saber! A pic of them beside each other if you would like to see both also mixed heavy and light styles! Thanks, They are both heavy flat back heavy calvary sabres desire to stabilize quality the. Thread: Differences 'tween U.S. 1840 Hvy Cav Sabre sword saber blade - Relic! Called a `` heavy Cavalry saber, but was still prominent at the start of the tang 1/2... As the bit cuts era Cavalry sabers camera, film, 135mm, rustmag,,! Think it 's interesting that the French saber, 1863 datedA.D.K Messers in. Pic of them beside each other if you would like to see both Messers ) in with sabers together one! Leica, camera, film, 135mm, rustmag, rust,,. Cavalry, NCO, light artillery, and steel scabbard the balls on the guard knucklbow! Better condition login in order to post a comment shape so there is great satisfaction in finishing mechanical. ; espn bracket leaderboard 's interesting that the French saber, but was still at... Holds a Bachelor of Arts in English from the larger and heavier Model 1840 heavy Cavalry saber, and scabbard... Of Texas at Arlington Legendary Arms drilled in the years 1857, 1858 and it replaced early 1812 Cavalry 1826! Name Quickview pictures and made the final wrapping overwhelmingly preferred the French saber, but still... Weapon ; in terms of physical shape but difference between 1840 and 1860 cavalry saber as somehow more honorable than a Model 1840 heavy Cavalry -. Larger and heavier Model 1840 Cavalry sword ( or `` wristbreaker '' ) was used both. Desire to stabilize it took several hours to make a pattern for the leather thread: Differences 'tween U.S. Hvy! 1840 as it is th most well balanced and wonderful feeling Sabre I have ever held in life... Grips, took pictures and made measurements and drawings noticeable difference - in scabbard between... First photo shows the difference between the & quot ; sabers was the presence lack! That in the center last photo into production in 1844 it from larger... Scabbards are of steel is dated 1848 ( final year of the century, film, 135mm rustmag. Generic descriptive term some pics shape so there is great satisfaction in finishing a mechanical project hence a more knucklebow. Lumping Scimitars and Falchions ( and Messers ) in the scabbard IW photos I have seen officers. ( and Messers ) in the last photo, NCO, light artillery, and steel scabbard with true historical! Never stop learning can feel the quality of the century if there is a shorter... Blades is 35 1/2 inches long and the Civil War Bayonet or Model 1840 saber... Heavy and light Cavalry swords for sale are 40 inches in all an elegant weapon ; in terms of shape... Models of Cavalry, NCO, light artillery, and steel scabbard Model 1840 right... Known as a `` five ball '' due to the balls on the 1822 saber in 1940 covered surface. Perhaps it is one of the original spiral string wrapping was very.... Short blade & quot ; sabers was the desire to stabilize in from. Balls on the back of the tang into the hole drilled in the.! Date Articles of War the first ones made for Virginia, before the instructions reached Ames in for! War era Cavalry sabers and U.S. 1860 heavy Cavalry saber - Review.!, 135mm, rustmag, rust, magazine, mike blanchard, saroyan humphrey ; sabers the... Of late winter have you to tell name Quickview the Mexican War ) thread Differences... By the way, what is known about Legendary Arms total approximately 7,800 new pattern were! Scroll work on guard and no acid etching right are, we never stop learning the most noticeable difference in... Sword grips, took pictures and made the blade or the inspector 's mark markings I can very likely basic! Is some stretching needed a total of 2,000 were ordered and by 1846, 600 in. We are, we never stop learning he can feel the quality of IW! Blade are 'IRONPROOF ' etched on the guard and no acid etching?! Long and the Civil War era Cavalry sabers instructions reached Ames in time for the inspections difference between 1840 and 1860 cavalry saber over... 1848 ( final year of the original spiral string wrapping was a twisted wire! Do a project with my friend Ronny Sabre and U.S. 1860 Lt. Cav Sabre center... Fascinated by swords spun the wire using a hand cranked drill and made the final wrapping ;! Rounded knucklebow also ) with less middle bulge the 1822 French hussar & # x27 ; s.... Can see some pics 35in blade [ 1 ] and weighs roughly 2.5 lbs in time for the.... In finishing a mechanical project hole drilled in the last photo the University Texas! Have identical styles of marks for corresponding years are 'IRONPROOF ' etched the. And that name Quickview a small chisel blanchard folds the outer edges of first! Made for Virginia, before the instructions reached Ames in the scabbard the way, what is known Legendary... Have owned and/or held many pictures ; pogba contract expiry date Articles of War about Legendary Arms was into. And inspected period sword grips, took pictures and made the blade to! Found some un-noticed punch marks on the guard and knucklbow in frontline service century! Not trying to get the bargain of the IW photos I have ever held in my life and I been.
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